How do I beat this deck? - 2007/03/08 17:26So, a little background. This is a Minmatar rush deck I threw together without a great deal of thought, to use as a kind of test deck for anything else I build. I want to see if my decks can stand up to an early game rush. Problem is, they can't. None of them. This is that Minmatar deck, and hopefully you guys can tell me if I've accidentally created an uber-deck (unlikely), or my other decks are just crap (likely ). Seeing as I obviously can't do it, I'd appreciate some tips on how to play or build against a rush deck like this too
News: 4x Mind Control 4x Adaster's Disaster 4x Slave-Dog Stowaways 2x Insurance Fraud 1x Martial Law 1x Remnant of Vak'Atioth
Locations: 4x Veldspar 4x Interstellar Trade Post 4x Echoes of Gloom Bay
Starbase Structures: 2x Moon Harvester
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Ryuteki
User Battlecruiser
Posts: 665
Re:How do I beat this deck? - 2007/03/08 20:07To keep your ships alive: 2-4x Hired Enforcers, 4x Stubborn Mechanics, also 4-8 anti-news cards. I like fielding at least a handful of ships that can only be targetted by one ship in the battle phase, and you can park that guy in Metropolis to help defend against the early rush. There are a number of ways of interfering with the income curve, but this deck doesn't have much in the way of disputable income it seems.
Give us a bit of info on why exactly it is winning. Is it trashing your fleet and then moving in? (My comments are based on that assumption). Are you populating your regions and failing to protect your home? (there are structures that help immensely with that second problem).-Ryuteki, Owner of the Rules! We're playing Monday evenings in IL, see www.games-plus.com for the address or email me at ryuteki AT gmail DOT com.
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Kester
User Frigate
Posts: 68
Re:How do I beat this deck? - 2007/03/08 20:52Ryuteki wrote: To keep your ships alive: 2-4x Hired Enforcers, 4x Stubborn Mechanics, also 4-8 anti-news cards. I like fielding at least a handful of ships that can only be targetted by one ship in the battle phase, and you can park that guy in Metropolis to help defend against the early rush. There are a number of ways of interfering with the income curve, but this deck doesn't have much in the way of disputable income it seems.
Give us a bit of info on why exactly it is winning. Is it trashing your fleet and then moving in? (My comments are based on that assumption). Are you populating your regions and failing to protect your home? (there are structures that help immensely with that second problem).
Hmm, I've tried a Gallente deck which was set up pretty much as you describe, with Metropolis and the news cards. The only thing I didn't do was use a Tormentor for the single target thing. I don't think it won a single game, but maybe that was bad luck.
The main problem I have beating the deck is that firstly, as you say, it has a very good income curve which is hard to disrupt; secondly, it has a lot of ways of destroying ships that don't rely on combat - a thrasher or scythe can usually be out on about turn 4 or 5, and frailty tower a turn or two later. Slave-dog stowaways is very nasty for slowing the opponent down in those critical early turns too.
I'm thinking of just turtling with juggernaut platforms and building some cruisers, but I really don't like putting myself on the defensive from the get-go, and it is pretty expensive.
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Ryuteki
User Battlecruiser
Posts: 665
Re:How do I beat this deck? - 2007/03/08 21:55You can also turtle behind such things as Warp Disruption Bubble and EMP Mine Fields, don't forget. Jugg Platforms aren't the only turtle shell out there if that's the route you decide to take.
I haven't played against Slave Dogs, so I don't have a good handle on their impact.
Anyone else want to throw in their anti-rush strategies? If we get enough in here one is bound to hit Kester's playstyle. -Ryuteki, Owner of the Rules! We're playing Monday evenings in IL, see www.games-plus.com for the address or email me at ryuteki AT gmail DOT com.
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stevetheone
User Battlecruiser
Posts: 540
Re:How do I beat this deck? - 2007/03/09 11:34Looking at the deck you have built quite a good one. The key to defeating it is, I think, producing more ships which is hard given you gone for the quick and cheap option.
Turtling with Warp Disruption will help but I would go for a patrol/observatory deck to win. Bung in some By the Emporer Decree and anti-news cards to help with Slave-Dogs problem and you should be doing alright.We shall seed the stars with our scions and reap that harvest.
No expect the Spam, spam, spam, spam...
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Smeelbo
User Cruiser
Posts: 224
Re:How do I beat this deck? - 2007/03/14 18:02Put this deck together out of spares, with two modifications. Used a Scrapmetal Garage instead of one of the Insurance Frauds, because my others are in my Zombie Apocalypse deck, and substituted Salvage Drones for Remnant. The deck did very well. It was very good at jamming up the opponent's plan in the early turns, although it did not build up punch quickly itself.
The Burst is a very thin reed to hold an early outer region with. But it was good in the early game.
Seems like a good deck to test against, which is, after all, what it was intended for.
Smeelbo
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CaptnB
User Cruiser
Posts: 104
Re:How do I beat this deck? - 2007/05/01 18:02I wouldn't recommend EMP Minefield here cause it only returns a ship already in your home region. So when you decide to use it, the attacker can still choose to put his Kamikaze on the pile. Resolving the pile will inflict damage then the EMP Minefield returns the dead ship home...
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RedX
User Cruiser
Posts: 129
Re:How do I beat this deck? - 2007/05/02 00:02CaptnB wrote: I wouldn't recommend EMP Minefield here cause it only returns a ship already in your home region. So when you decide to use it, the attacker can still choose to put his Kamikaze on the pile. Resolving the pile will inflict damage then the EMP Minefield returns the dead ship home...
Only if you're silly enough to wait until the beginning of battle step to use the Minefield. If you do it during the enemy's Management Phase, the ship cannot kamikaze and goes back to the enemy's dock like a good little suicidal clone-piloted explosive junkheap.
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CaptnB
User Cruiser
Posts: 104
Re:How do I beat this deck? - 2007/05/02 15:26Humm, that's a good point. The ennemy has to warp in your home region during his management phase. Now that changes a few things ... Forget previuous post then, EMP Minefield is great!!!
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Smugger
User Frigate
Posts: 54
Re:How do I beat this deck? - 2007/05/02 15:48if you send ships back during the management phase what stops the opponet from just undocking them and warp them back again? As far as I know you are free to undock and warp as much as you like during your management phase.
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RedX
User Cruiser
Posts: 129
Re:How do I beat this deck? - 2007/05/02 16:56Smugger wrote: if you send ships back during the management phase what stops the opponet from just undocking them and warp them back again? As far as I know you are free to undock and warp as much as you like during your management phase.
From the rules: "If you warp a ship into an enemy controlled region, your ship has attacked that region and cannot execute any of its abilities, activate any of its commands, or warp again during this management phase."
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Smugger
User Frigate
Posts: 54
Re:How do I beat this deck? - 2007/05/03 09:13RedX wrote: Smugger wrote: if you send ships back during the management phase what stops the opponet from just undocking them and warp them back again? As far as I know you are free to undock and warp as much as you like during your management phase.
From the rules: "If you warp a ship into an enemy controlled region, your ship has attacked that region and cannot execute any of its abilities, activate any of its commands, or warp again during this management phase." Ah, yes, ofcours. I didn't think of that as the ship would no longer be in the enemy region, but it still has been there and so is affected by that rule.
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). Seeing as I obviously can't do it, I'd appreciate some tips on how to play or build against a rush deck like this too 
... Forget previuous post then, EMP Minefield is great!!!
