kamikaze - 2008/10/07 02:22if an attacker uses a kamakaze and a defender uses one too who actually does the damage first?
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Brootal
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Re:kamikaze - 2008/10/07 03:48simple pile rules, first on last off.
Attacker has the initiative, declares kamikaze, defender declares kamikaze. defender's resolves first.
ie.
Attacker removes his ship to scrapheap. attacker kamikaze goes on the pile Defender removes ship to scrapheap defender kamikaze goes on the pile. players pass defender kamikaze resolves attacker kamikaze resolves
Either way, both damages resolve (unless the attacker targeted the defender's kamikaze ship, in which case it fails, but if the attacker only had the lone ship, the defender cannot kamikaze in return to prevent the damage, because there is no valid target for the kamikaze ability (The ship was removed as a cost before the defender gets the initiative).
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rom
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Re:kamikaze - 2008/10/07 13:14^^ And you call that simple
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nox
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Re:kamikaze - 2008/10/08 02:23eg. say i move a single typhoon into my enemy's home region, i then kamikaze against the starbase, the ememys counters by kamikaze'ing ahainst my typhoon. how does this resolve?
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nox
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Re:kamikaze - 2008/10/08 02:34are there any cards that can prevent kamikaze's or is it entirely up to emp minefields and news?
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DrVulcan
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Re:kamikaze - 2008/10/08 05:18My understanding is that both go off, the starbase is gone.
News and minefields, etc are good defense for this, and really are your only sure fire way to stop it, secondary defense are some of the locations, better starbase shields, etc, but overall, you have to play a game against kamikaze knowing that they are paying for the ability by having weaker ships, and keep pressing them, don't let them build up a fleet, even if it means sacrificing your ships here and there to theirs. I find that kamikaze decks are a solid option, but not a win all kinda thing, and their ability to win seems to go down quite a bit in larger games (3 free for all, or more) in my experience anyway =)
Post edited by: DrVulcan, at: 2008/10/08 05:19
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Kempeth
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Re:kamikaze - 2008/10/08 07:02nox wrote: are there any cards that can prevent kamikaze's or is it entirely up to emp minefields and news? Yes. EMP Minefields and News. Basically anything that removes a ship from your home region before the battle phase starts.
Veteran's Premature Retirement for example...
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Onyx Verde
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Re:kamikaze - 2008/10/08 09:35Nox's question about the Typhoon got answered by Brootal's previous post " both damages resolve (unless the attacker targeted the defenders kamikaze ship, in which case it fails...)"
In other words the kamikaze-ing Typhoon is no longer there (it's on the scrapheap) so it's not a valid target anymore.
Deciding to kamikaze ships that are targets for your opponents kamikaze-ing ships is a great way to make the attack fizzle out (no valid targets when the pile resolves!)============================ "There is always Hope...." - Elessar Telcontar ============================
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DimaCh
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Re:kamikaze - 2008/10/22 15:40As far as I understood the kamikaze deck could played as - at the beginning of the round all kamikaze hit the star base. If the damage dealt is equal to start base's shields then the game is over. Did I get it right?
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rom
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Re:kamikaze - 2008/10/22 20:47Jes kamikaze is really difficuld to block. You can not prevent kamikaze with ships, or ambush patrol or anything else. The only thing that helps are news. But Minmatar also have a card so news canīt be played. So kamikaze is still a good way to win a game.
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Onyx Verde
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Re:kamikaze - 2008/10/23 08:46DimaCh, your understanding of kamikaze-ing a starbase is correct, but it's the TOTAL shields that need to be exceeded, not just the starting shield value.
It occurs to me that we left out one viable anti-kamikaze tactic: A defending Thrasher and a big pile of money can nerf any attacking kamikaze ships during the attacker's Management Phase, i.e. just after the attacking ships have warped in but before the Battle Phase commences.============================ "There is always Hope...." - Elessar Telcontar ============================
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Brootal
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Re:kamikaze - 2008/10/23 23:13Onyx Verde wrote: It occurs to me that we left out one viable anti-kamikaze tactic: A defending Thrasher and a big pile of money can nerf any attacking kamikaze ships during the attacker's Management Phase, i.e. just after the attacking ships have warped in but before the Battle Phase commences.
Yes it's good against the basic kamikaze rush, but it doesn't stop ANY kamikaze attack, it can't stop a typhoon or Wreath A typhoon will crush an unupgraded starbase, a typhoon and a few wreaths will should take care of a lightly upgraded starbase.
The other viable anti kamikaze tactic is lots of starbase structures with + shields, esp Juggernaut Platform if you can play it.
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rom
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Re:kamikaze - 2008/10/24 22:15Each tactic can be countered somehow. Thatīs what makes this game so interesting. Kamikaze is a strong strategy but still has itīs weak spotīs and it also can be prevented. The challange to do this is to implement some antikamikaze stuff in each of your decks. Or simply to think about: "What happenes if I play with my deck against a kamikaze deck. Do i have the right cards to deal with it or some other tactics to win against such a deck" This not only goes for kamikaze but also against all other decktypes. One thing is also clear. You can not build a deck that can deal with all stuff. So have fun while building your Deck
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DimaCh
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Re:kamikaze - 2008/11/03 12:14 It occurs to me that we left out one viable anti-kamikaze tactic:
A defending Thrasher and a big pile of money can nerf any attacking kamikaze ships during the attacker's Management Phase, i.e. just after the attacking ships have warped in but before the Battle Phase commences. Well, the tactics with Thrasher is interesting but I can't find in rules that a ship is located in a target region during the warp. If I understood correctly, warp - is the process of movement from one region to another. As soon the ship is in the region the battle phase begins. May be I am making it too complex, but were there any clarifications on this?
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Brootal
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Re:kamikaze - 2008/11/03 20:57DimaCh wrote: is the process of movement from one region to another. As soon the ship is in the region the battle phase begins. May be I am making it too complex, but were there any clarifications on this? This is not correct, the battle phase(s) does not begin until the management phase is complete. If they did you could only attack one region per turn. The management phase is not complete until both players pass their initiative.
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